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Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 9th, 2018, 3:23 pm
by Aolian
Is it morally wrong or ethically inexpedient to have more than one wife?
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 9th, 2018, 10:44 pm
by Alias
What does "ethically" inexpedient mean?
No, it's not wrong to have more than one wife or husband. It's not wrong to marry, or cohabit with, however many, and whatever gender of consenting adults wish to share a lifestyle, a commitment, partnership, parenting and housekeeping duties, sexual relations, income and resources - whatever.
It's wrong to mislead and deceive romantic partners, to oppress or exploit them, to abuse their goodwill or betray their trust.
As long as you have mutual trust, respect and affection, it's nobody's business with whom you share them.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 11th, 2018, 4:16 pm
by ThomasHobbes
Aolian wrote: ↑May 9th, 2018, 3:23 pm
Is it morally wrong or ethically inexpedient to have more than one wife?
Is it morally wrong or ethically inexpedient for a woman to have more than one husband?
If it morally sound for two people to be bound together for life by a contract signed with the state?
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 15th, 2018, 2:59 am
by LuckyR
Assuming that everyone in the relationship goes into it with all of the available information, the problem with plural marriage is neither moral nor ethical. Rather legal, cultural and practical.
A triple star system is inherently unstable and at best ends up as a binary system with a remotely orbiting third star around the center of gravity of the binary stars.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 7:56 am
by Belindi
LuckyR wrote: ↑May 15th, 2018, 2:59 am
Assuming that everyone in the relationship goes into it with all of the available information, the problem with plural marriage is neither moral nor ethical. Rather legal, cultural and practical.
A triple star system is inherently unstable and at best ends up as a binary system with a remotely orbiting third star around the center of gravity of the binary stars.
Ethical participants in polyamory , or any other moral commitment, will strive to be fair to all the persons involved. Stars are amoral.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 12:58 pm
by CIN
Aolian wrote: ↑May 9th, 2018, 3:23 pm
Is it morally wrong or ethically inexpedient to have more than one wife?
I don't myself consider it morally wrong per se, but I do wonder whether a man with two wives is going to treat them as equals (i.e. equal to himself, not to each other).
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 1:49 pm
by Eduk
This reminds me of the idea that pain is in the mind. Sure it is. If I want I can set myself on fire and then sit down and read a good book. Of course in reality it would be extremely hard to do so. Not just because the book would be on fire.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 2:36 pm
by LuckyR
Belindi wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 7:56 am
LuckyR wrote: ↑May 15th, 2018, 2:59 am
Assuming that everyone in the relationship goes into it with all of the available information, the problem with plural marriage is neither moral nor ethical. Rather legal, cultural and practical.
A triple star system is inherently unstable and at best ends up as a binary system with a remotely orbiting third star around the center of gravity of the binary stars.
Ethical participants in polyamory , or any other moral commitment,
will strive to be fair to all the persons involved. Stars are amoral.
And I am sure it will work great... in years 1-4, how about year 20? Not that binary marriages are immune to problems (far from it), my point is that whatever the risk of trouble is, the impact of trouble is multiplied when you add additional personalities, baggage and quirks into the mix.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 4:16 pm
by Alias
LuckyR wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 2:36 pm
And I am sure it will work great... in years 1-4, how about year 20? Not that binary marriages are immune to problems (far from it), my point is that whatever the risk of trouble is, the impact of trouble is multiplied when you add additional personalities, baggage and quirks into the mix.
On the other hand, you also add the balancing factors of a potential arbitrator when there is conflict between two of the people, a possible confidant or emotional support when there is a misunderstanding, another person to share the financial burden, child-care and household chores, perhaps reducing the usual stresses on a relationship.
Didn't a wise man say: As usual, it depends. ?
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 4:28 pm
by LuckyR
Alias wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 4:16 pm
LuckyR wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 2:36 pm
And I am sure it will work great... in years 1-4, how about year 20? Not that binary marriages are immune to problems (far from it), my point is that whatever the risk of trouble is, the impact of trouble is multiplied when you add additional personalities, baggage and quirks into the mix.
On the other hand, you also add the balancing factors of a potential arbitrator when there is conflict between two of the people, a possible confidant or emotional support when there is a misunderstanding, another person to share the financial burden, child-care and household chores, perhaps reducing the usual stresses on a relationship.
Didn't a wise man say: As usual, it depends. ?
No doubt those are valid points and I certainly hope it works out just the way you say, though despite the logic of equality, the pyramid tends to have that pointy top. That is, folks inherently compare and compete. There is a natural tendency to "win" and thereby create "losers". Hence the natural instability of three celestial objects. Theoretically they can coexist equally but here in the Real World there is no such thing as true equality.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 5:49 pm
by Belindi
CIN wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 12:58 pm
Aolian wrote: ↑May 9th, 2018, 3:23 pm
Is it morally wrong or ethically inexpedient to have more than one wife?
I don't myself consider it morally wrong per se, but I do wonder whether a man with two wives is going to treat them as equals (i.e. equal to himself, not to each other).
I think that the anthropological literature suggests that the wives make sure that the system works fairly. " Fairly" can mean that in practise there is a head wife and a love wife plus the others. The head wife's duty is to see that favours are allocated equally. Division of labour between the sexes is more likely to be fair when the wives are multiple enough to gang up on an erring husband.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 6:00 pm
by ThomasHobbes
CIN wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 12:58 pm
Aolian wrote: ↑May 9th, 2018, 3:23 pm
Is it morally wrong or ethically inexpedient to have more than one wife?
I don't myself consider it morally wrong per se, but I do wonder whether a man with two wives is going to treat them as equals (i.e. equal to himself, not to each other).
I think this has always been a key problem with ANY system of marriage. Plural marriage is no more likely to make this a problem.
Plural marriage is more likely to impact on male inequality due to a shortage of eligible wives.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 16th, 2018, 7:18 pm
by Alias
LuckyR wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 4:28 pm
No doubt those are valid points and I certainly hope it works out just the way you say,
I only say it
might work that way. For some people - certainly not all. But then, one+one marriage doesn't work for everyone, either.
though despite the logic of equality, the pyramid tends to have that pointy top. That is, folks inherently compare and compete. There is a natural tendency to "win" and thereby create "losers".
How many marriages - or partnerships, of any kind, for that matter - do you know wherein two participants are equal? In the
best case, they take turns dominating in particular situations, or areas of responsibility; in most cases, there is a dominant person, or the one who makes most of the important decisions and gets their own way most often, even if they pretend otherwise.
Then, too, there are still quite a lot of people in the world who don't even pretend to strive for equality.
Hence the natural instability of three celestial objects.
And the notorious stability of tripods.
People are neither - they have all different temperaments, needs and abilities.
Theoretically they can coexist equally but here in the Real World there is no such thing as true equality.
"True equality" (ha!) wasn't a prerequisite of marriage.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 17th, 2018, 2:39 am
by LuckyR
Alias wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 7:18 pm
LuckyR wrote: ↑May 16th, 2018, 4:28 pm
No doubt those are valid points and I certainly hope it works out just the way you say,
I only say it
might work that way. For some people - certainly not all. But then, one+one marriage doesn't work for everyone, either.
though despite the logic of equality, the pyramid tends to have that pointy top. That is, folks inherently compare and compete. There is a natural tendency to "win" and thereby create "losers".
How many marriages - or partnerships, of any kind, for that matter - do you know wherein two participants are equal? In the
best case, they take turns dominating in particular situations, or areas of responsibility; in most cases, there is a dominant person, or the one who makes most of the important decisions and gets their own way most often, even if they pretend otherwise.
Then, too, there are still quite a lot of people in the world who don't even pretend to strive for equality.
Hence the natural instability of three celestial objects.
And the notorious stability of tripods.
People are neither - they have all different temperaments, needs and abilities.
Theoretically they can coexist equally but here in the Real World there is no such thing as true equality.
"True equality" (ha!) wasn't a prerequisite of marriage.
I apologize for being difficult to understand. You are correct that individuals in binary marriage are not equal. As it happens I wasn't talking about individuals, I was speaking of relationships. Since there is only one relationship in a binary marriage (say A is married to B), then A to B is "equal" to B to A, as they are the same thing. OTOH, in A, B and C marriage, there are subrelationships, A to B and A to C (say A is the male and B and C are female). These can never be absolutely equal. That is the potential source of competition and resentment.
Re: Plural marriage vs monogamy
Posted: May 17th, 2018, 3:24 am
by Eduk
By the way why limit to more than one wife? Does the equation change if it's more than one husband?
Also we seem to be ignoring everyone else outside of the plural marriage?
Out of interest. The only modern day example of plural marriage I can think of is certain Mormon communities. I have little to no experience of such a community. I was wondering if anyone had? In those communities how common are monogamous marriages?